Haha, yeah. I pretty much think my biggest problem with IV is simply that my start in seriously gaming was just too late for me to like/put up with some of the tropes, especially since I wasn't old enough to have played it when it first came out so I got exposed to it after Final Fantasies I like much better. On the other hand getting frustrated with the deaths/come backs made me appreciate Cait Sith's death/return in VII more--I'm not sure if he's supposed to be specifically parodying that game or just in general the whole "noble sacrifice" thing, but the matter-of-fact return makes me think IV.
And ha, I probably am confusing you a little with the late comments, because yeah, you did mention Kain not having much character outside the mind control. Though...I think it's also, "never-getting-the-girl" doesn't make him tragic. Now that you've mentioned that perspective I'm also remembering someone talking about Kain and "friendzoning" (as something they didn't like about the writing). I can't remember any specifics about it as it was a while ago, I'm not sure if they were talking about Kain not respecting Rosa's choice or fans for thinking poorly of her simply for choosing Cecil or both--actually I do remember a bit now. The thing that made the poster angry is because some fans were seriously mad at Cecil and Rosa for having a happy reunion in front of Kain and not "considering his feelings", like the fact that he didn't get Rosa is more important than Rosa having been kidnapped and in danger for a good amount of time. And it's like... your write-up mentioned a flashback with them as kids and how you can see even then that Rosa is gearing toward Cecil. Kain never-getting-the-girl is not due to a tragic event, like death or enforced separation or a misunderstanding or even Rosa somehow accidentally sending mixed signals. She was just never into him, and he's really lousy at moving on. Because he should have. I wouldn't say he's evil for not doing so, but that he didn't reads as kind of flimsy at best (he couldn't find someone else he loved/something else to focus on?) and gross at worst for not respecting her choice (was he hoping even when Cecil and Rosa became serious that she would have a sudden change of heart and go for him?). Kain's part in the love triangle could have been bolstered to give him a reason to be hurt about it; if they'd been dating a year or two ago but Rosa broke up with him because she realized he wasn't right for her and he was trying to be a good friend to both but still smarting over the breakup, he'd still be in the wrong but it'd be fresher to explain why he hasn't completely gotten over it yet. But it also just would have been nicer for them to focus more on the friendship he betrayed, because... I don't know. He always recognizes he was in the wrong, but it doesn't feel like patching things up with Cecil specifically is a priority for him? Unless I missed something.
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Haha, yeah. I pretty much think my biggest problem with IV is simply that my start in seriously gaming was just too late for me to like/put up with some of the tropes, especially since I wasn't old enough to have played it when it first came out so I got exposed to it after Final Fantasies I like much better. On the other hand getting frustrated with the deaths/come backs made me appreciate Cait Sith's death/return in VII more--I'm not sure if he's supposed to be specifically parodying that game or just in general the whole "noble sacrifice" thing, but the matter-of-fact return makes me think IV.
And ha, I probably am confusing you a little with the late comments, because yeah, you did mention Kain not having much character outside the mind control. Though...I think it's also, "never-getting-the-girl" doesn't make him tragic. Now that you've mentioned that perspective I'm also remembering someone talking about Kain and "friendzoning" (as something they didn't like about the writing). I can't remember any specifics about it as it was a while ago, I'm not sure if they were talking about Kain not respecting Rosa's choice or fans for thinking poorly of her simply for choosing Cecil or both--actually I do remember a bit now. The thing that made the poster angry is because some fans were seriously mad at Cecil and Rosa for having a happy reunion in front of Kain and not "considering his feelings", like the fact that he didn't get Rosa is more important than Rosa having been kidnapped and in danger for a good amount of time. And it's like... your write-up mentioned a flashback with them as kids and how you can see even then that Rosa is gearing toward Cecil. Kain never-getting-the-girl is not due to a tragic event, like death or enforced separation or a misunderstanding or even Rosa somehow accidentally sending mixed signals. She was just never into him, and he's really lousy at moving on. Because he should have. I wouldn't say he's evil for not doing so, but that he didn't reads as kind of flimsy at best (he couldn't find someone else he loved/something else to focus on?) and gross at worst for not respecting her choice (was he hoping even when Cecil and Rosa became serious that she would have a sudden change of heart and go for him?). Kain's part in the love triangle could have been bolstered to give him a reason to be hurt about it; if they'd been dating a year or two ago but Rosa broke up with him because she realized he wasn't right for her and he was trying to be a good friend to both but still smarting over the breakup, he'd still be in the wrong but it'd be fresher to explain why he hasn't completely gotten over it yet. But it also just would have been nicer for them to focus more on the friendship he betrayed, because... I don't know. He always recognizes he was in the wrong, but it doesn't feel like patching things up with Cecil specifically is a priority for him? Unless I missed something.